Ford Ecoboost gas mileage and reliability???

[bowler1]

Well I read the post below and I am convinced that the Ecoboost is a towing beast.

Certainly superb performance, but there are two areas that I have heard bad things about this truck. First is in reliability. Second is in gas mileage...surprisingly. People have said that it does not live up to its mpg claims and that it fares worse that most V8s towing.

What is your experience?

It certainly is tempting, given its performance, but total ownership cost and reliability are pretty important to me.

thanks
Matt

[riven1950]

2015 ECO at Baja

A little Ford hype but interesting

[tragusa3]

The shudder feels like a little slack in the drive line, or like a wobble in the drive shaft? Not sure how to explain it.

It was described to me as a product of drive shaft alignment with the 157" wheelbase trucks and the ecoboost. I also heard that many of the folks with large diesels have a similar issue (as goducks10 attests to). I'm assuming due to large amounts of torque right at takeoff speed when the drive shaft starts up spinning.

I'm not putting my ecoboost in the same category with the Cummins, but it might be a similarity.

[parkersdad]

Tystevens wrote:

parkersdad wrote:

tragusa3 wrote:
I'm with you Mitch. Putting my chips on the Ecoboost proving itself for the long term. I'll sell in a heartbeat if I'm having issues in warranty. 5,000 miles so far and I've only noticed the "5mph shudder". I'm hearing it's a product of torque and not a concern. Still don't like how it feels.

What is the it's a product of torque comment? The Ecoboost has no more torque than say a Ram 1500, it is just lower in the power band. I think ford is handing out a bunch of crap.

Maybe peak torque output is similar w/ a Ram (~410 ft/lb) and Ecoboost (420 ft/lb). But the Ecoboost is putting out probably twice the torque of the Ram at 1800 rpm. Which is right around where you're probably at on take off. Although I haven't experienced this shuddering in my Ecoboost, either.

Have you driven an Ecoboost? If not, you should try it out before you call it a load of crap! Of course, it is a matter of preference how/where you want your torque, but for me, the power delivery characteristics of this motor sealed the deal.

When I say a load of******I mean Ford motor company. They are famous for covering up problems. I drive a 6.7 Cummins and mine has plenty of power.

[goducks10]

Wanna feel some shudder? Drive a 12 Ram Cummins. 800lbs of torque @1600 rpms.
I've had shudder from day 1. It's just the way it is. I am surprised the Eco has it though. Sounds more like a programing thing if some do and some don't.

[Tystevens]

parkersdad wrote:

tragusa3 wrote:
I'm with you Mitch. Putting my chips on the Ecoboost proving itself for the long term. I'll sell in a heartbeat if I'm having issues in warranty. 5,000 miles so far and I've only noticed the "5mph shudder". I'm hearing it's a product of torque and not a concern. Still don't like how it feels.

What is the it's a product of torque comment? The Ecoboost has no more torque than say a Ram 1500, it is just lower in the power band. I think ford is handing out a bunch of crap.

Maybe peak torque output is similar w/ a Ram (~410 ft/lb) and Ecoboost (420 ft/lb). But the Ecoboost is putting out probably twice the torque of the Ram at 1800 rpm. Which is right around where you're probably at on take off. Although I haven't experienced this shuddering in my Ecoboost, either.

Have you driven an Ecoboost? If not, you should try it out before you call it a load of crap! Of course, it is a matter of preference how/where you want your torque, but for me, the power delivery characteristics of this motor sealed the deal.

[parkersdad]

tragusa3 wrote:
I'm with you Mitch. Putting my chips on the Ecoboost proving itself for the long term. I'll sell in a heartbeat if I'm having issues in warranty. 5,000 miles so far and I've only noticed the "5mph shudder". I'm hearing it's a product of torque and not a concern. Still don't like how it feels.

What is the it's a product of torque comment? The Ecoboost has no more torque than say a Ram 1500, it is just lower in the power band. I think ford is handing out a bunch of crap.

[oxygen]

tragusa3 wrote:
I'm with you Mitch. Putting my chips on the Ecoboost proving itself for the long term. I'll sell in a heartbeat if I'm having issues in warranty. 5,000 miles so far and I've only noticed the "5mph shudder". I'm hearing it's a product of torque and not a concern. Still don't like how it feels.

what is the 5mph shudder? Never heard of it before

[tragusa3]

I'm with you Mitch. Putting my chips on the Ecoboost proving itself for the long term. I'll sell in a heartbeat if I'm having issues in warranty. 5,000 miles so far and I've only noticed the "5mph shudder". I'm hearing it's a product of torque and not a concern. Still don't like how it feels.

[Buck50HD]

Mike Up wrote:

Buck50HD wrote:

Mike, your math is correct but you missed something. There is an 11% reduction in HP/wt of the base vehicle but it will be used for towing.

If you consider my GCW was 15,500 with the F150HD, my heavier 6.2 will push that to 16650. Given those totals, here are some comparisons of the eco, 5.0 and 6.2 super duty.

365HP eco -> 385HP F250 = 1.8% lower HP/wt
360HP 5.0 -> 385HP F250 = 0.4% lower HP/wt
420TQ eco -> 405TQ F250 = 10.2% lower TQ/wt
380TQ 5.0 -> 405TQ F250 = 0.8% lower TQ/wt

So, you can see that even towing, there is a noticeable difference between the eco and 6.2 (particularly TQ) but I've basically stepped back to the equivalent of a 5.0. If you consider the torque curve of the 6.2, it's going to feel better than a 5.0 pulling the same weight.

Now I'll know what your setup feels like compared to an eco:)

Not sure how you figured out your numbers because none make sense to me.

BUT as I stated, the "TORQUE" to weight issue is the one I was looking at, not HP.

The dealer loaded XLT F250 6.2L Screw had the 3.73 open differential, chrome package and everything my loaded XLT has. The F250 added telescoping mirrors and tailgate step.

The F250's GVWR is 10,000 lbs, and it's Yellow Tread Act Tire Loading sticker stated the payload was 2833 lbs. So to get the real weight of the actual truck, subtract that 2833 lbs payload from it's 10,000 lbs GVWR. You then have a truck that weighs 7,167 lbs.

My truck in the signature weighs 5768 lbs. My GVWR is 7350 lbs and my Yellow Tread Act Tire Loading sticker states my payload is 1582 lbs. So 7350 lbs - 1582 lbs is 5768 lbs

So the F250 is 7,167 lbs and my F150 is 5768 lbs.

Now the Torque for the F250 is 405 lbs at 4500 rpms. Using 7167 lbs / 405 ft lbs = 17.696

Now that we have the torque to weight factor, we can use that against my truck by taking it's weight of 5768 lbs and dividing by the same factor. 5768/17.696 = 326 ft lbs.

So with the same torque to weight factor as the F250 6.2L, my truck would only have 326 ft lbs at a more lofty 4500 lbs. My 5.0L offers 380 ft lbs at 4250 rpms.

So you can see that the F250 has significantly less torque than my truck, to pull a heavy trailer. And on top of that, that torque peak is at an even higher rpm.

In fact the torque factor of 17.696 is even lower than what my Sport Trac V8 had. It's 4.6L offered 300 ft lbs at 4000 rpms. Without it's factory hard tonneau cover, it weighed 4,992 lbs. 4,992 lbs/ 17.696 would be only 282 ft lbs at a much loftier 4500 rpms.

As you can see, even my Sport Trac had more torque at 500 rpms lower than the F250.

Now, I'm not saying that the motor is bad because I like it. I'm just saying that I wouldn't want to pull more than 9000 lbs with it.

I've towed a 5000 lbs loaded Jayco Jay Flight 19BH with the Sport Trac and it towed it extremely easy. The F150 tows the 6500 lbs loaded Jayco Jay Flight 26BH even easier. So both trucks have a lot of reserve power that's not used.

I feel the F250 6.2L could pull a 9,000 lbs Loaded Jayco Jay Flight trailer, but it would be right at it's limits of offering a stress free tow.

I see your 5th wheel is right about 9000 lbs so it's obviously working out for you, no big deal. I'm just saying I wouldn't want to tow a heavier trailer without upgrading to more power, that being the 6.7L Diesel.

I loved the F250's stability and ride quality, and especially it's very high 2833 lbs payload for such a loaded truck.

I would buy it without reservation to tow if I need the extra capabilities of the Super Duty chassis.

For pulling a camper that's 9000 lbs and the need for high payload, I'd order a 5.0L Screw 4WD Heavy Duty Payload option truck. I looked and none were available so I'd have to order. I don't have the luxury of ordering and waiting around. I actually didn't need the extra payload as it turns out and don't plan on ever getting a bigger or heavier trailer. If anything, a smaller one. 😉 So I lucked out in my truck working out good for me.

I'd still like a F250, but for $10,000 dollars more including my X-plan and rebates, it just wasn't worth it for 'me'.

I'm glad you like your truck and it's working out good for you.

I think we agree. My point was to calculate HP and TQ to weight ratios using a gross combined weight while pulling a 9k trailer. I know it's slower with the bare truck but when you hook up 9k, the 1150lb heavier truck is a very small % of the total.

BTW, I took it for a spin for the first time last night and wouldn't hesitate pulling 12k with the way it handles 9.

[MitchF150]

Now, I guess it's just how long are these "Egoboosts" going to last... 😉

I'm banking on them going awhile! I got 255,000 miles out of my 97 F150 with the 5.4/E4OD combo...

I've been hearing about they tend to get gas in the oil from the "direct injection", but if you change the oil at around 5k miles, it's a 'non issue'...

I guess only time is going to tell... They've been out since 2011.. I've got a late build 2013, with 2200 miles on it now and haven't towed yet, but will later this month and it's first real trip in May...

If I start having issues with it during it's warranty period, I'll have some decisions to make... I'm in this for the long haul and not looking to get another truck for awhile... I'd like to think I can get 255,000 miles and 17 years outta this truck! 🙂

Mitch

[Mike_Up]

Buck50HD wrote:

Mike, your math is correct but you missed something. There is an 11% reduction in HP/wt of the base vehicle but it will be used for towing.

If you consider my GCW was 15,500 with the F150HD, my heavier 6.2 will push that to 16650. Given those totals, here are some comparisons of the eco, 5.0 and 6.2 super duty.

365HP eco -> 385HP F250 = 1.8% lower HP/wt
360HP 5.0 -> 385HP F250 = 0.4% lower HP/wt
420TQ eco -> 405TQ F250 = 10.2% lower TQ/wt
380TQ 5.0 -> 405TQ F250 = 0.8% lower TQ/wt

So, you can see that even towing, there is a noticeable difference between the eco and 6.2 (particularly TQ) but I've basically stepped back to the equivalent of a 5.0. If you consider the torque curve of the 6.2, it's going to feel better than a 5.0 pulling the same weight.

Now I'll know what your setup feels like compared to an eco:)

Not sure how you figured out your numbers because none make sense to me.

BUT as I stated, the "TORQUE" to weight issue is the one I was looking at, not HP.

The dealer loaded XLT F250 6.2L Screw had the 3.73 open differential, chrome package and everything my loaded XLT has. The F250 added telescoping mirrors and tailgate step.

The F250's GVWR is 10,000 lbs, and it's Yellow Tread Act Tire Loading sticker stated the payload was 2833 lbs. So to get the real weight of the actual truck, subtract that 2833 lbs payload from it's 10,000 lbs GVWR. You then have a truck that weighs 7,167 lbs.

My truck in the signature weighs 5768 lbs. My GVWR is 7350 lbs and my Yellow Tread Act Tire Loading sticker states my payload is 1582 lbs. So 7350 lbs - 1582 lbs is 5768 lbs

So the F250 is 7,167 lbs and my F150 is 5768 lbs.

Now the Torque for the F250 is 405 lbs at 4500 rpms. Using 7167 lbs / 405 ft lbs = 17.696

Now that we have the torque to weight factor, we can use that against my truck by taking it's weight of 5768 lbs and dividing by the same factor. 5768/17.696 = 326 ft lbs.

So with the same torque to weight factor as the F250 6.2L, my truck would only have 326 ft lbs at a more lofty 4500 lbs. My 5.0L offers 380 ft lbs at 4250 rpms.

So you can see that the F250 has significantly less torque than my truck, to pull a heavy trailer. And on top of that, that torque peak is at an even higher rpm.

In fact the torque factor of 17.696 is even lower than what my Sport Trac V8 had. It's 4.6L offered 300 ft lbs at 4000 rpms. Without it's factory hard tonneau cover, it weighed 4,992 lbs. 4,992 lbs/ 17.696 would be only 282 ft lbs at a much loftier 4500 rpms.

As you can see, even my Sport Trac had more torque at 500 rpms lower than the F250.

Now, I'm not saying that the motor is bad because I like it. I'm just saying that I wouldn't want to pull more than 9000 lbs with it.

I've towed a 5000 lbs loaded Jayco Jay Flight 19BH with the Sport Trac and it towed it extremely easy. The F150 tows the 6500 lbs loaded Jayco Jay Flight 26BH even easier. So both trucks have a lot of reserve power that's not used.

I feel the F250 6.2L could pull a 9,000 lbs Loaded Jayco Jay Flight trailer, but it would be right at it's limits of offering a stress free tow.

I see your 5th wheel is right about 9000 lbs so it's obviously working out for you, no big deal. I'm just saying I wouldn't want to tow a heavier trailer without upgrading to more power, that being the 6.7L Diesel.

I loved the F250's stability and ride quality, and especially it's very high 2833 lbs payload for such a loaded truck.

I would buy it without reservation to tow if I need the extra capabilities of the Super Duty chassis.

For pulling a camper that's 9000 lbs and the need for high payload, I'd order a 5.0L Screw 4WD Heavy Duty Payload option truck. I looked and none were available so I'd have to order. I don't have the luxury of ordering and waiting around. I actually didn't need the extra payload as it turns out and don't plan on ever getting a bigger or heavier trailer. If anything, a smaller one. 😉 So I lucked out in my truck working out good for me.

I'd still like a F250, but for $10,000 dollars more including my X-plan and rebates, it just wasn't worth it for 'me'.

I'm glad you like your truck and it's working out good for you.

[Buck50HD]

Mike Up wrote:

Buck50HD wrote:

More capacity. Certainly not more performance because that has been a downgrade. I was at the rear axle and GVW rating and barely had anything loaded in the trailer. Doable but had to be careful. Also wanted to start towing a boat behind the 5th and putting some stuff in the truck bed(generator, spare battery, boat motor). Miss the eco... it was a towing machine, especially paired with the HD payload package.

Here's a thread I made at F150forum about my test drive in a 2014 F250 with 6.2L and 3.73 gears. Engine had less performance than my 2008 Sport Trac with a 4.6L 3V engine. Why, the very poor power to weight ratio. The F250 felt very under-powered with the 6.2L as it's torque to weight ratio would equate to only 325 lbs of torque at 4500 rpms in my 5768 lbs F150. Would had equated to 286 lbs at 4500 rpm in the Sport Trac compared to it's 4.6L's 300 lbs at 4000 rpms. The F250 weighed 7167 lbs from the factory. 10,000 lbs GVWR - 2833 lbs Tread Act Payload rating = 7167 lbs.

Truck was very very nice in stability and ride but for heavy trailers, you really do need the 6.7L Diesel if you don't want to struggle.

The other option is to either get a 5.0L or Ecoboost HEAVY DUTY SUSPENSION Package which will net in the low 2000 lbs of payload with a 8200 lbs GVWR and 4800 lbs rear axle. I prefer the 5.0L over the Ecoboost but couldn't find a 5.0L Heavy 1/2 anywhere within a 200 mile radius. Alright because my truck came with a pretty decent 1582 lbs payload plus I got to get a locking axle, chrome package, larger tires and other options not available on the heavy half.

I'd consider the 5.0L as well. Its a great tow vehicle despite ecoboost owner's negative comments.

The F250 was featured exactly like my truck in the signature except the lack of a locking axle, it had the tailgate step, and had telescoping trailer mirrors.

I was really expecting better performance but never did the math to realize I shouldn't had expected much.

Mike, your math is correct but you missed something. There is an 11% reduction in HP/wt of the base vehicle but it will be used for towing.

If you consider my GCW was 15,500 with the F150HD, my heavier 6.2 will push that to 16650. Given those totals, here are some comparisons of the eco, 5.0 and 6.2 super duty.

365HP eco -> 385HP F250 = 1.8% lower HP/wt
360HP 5.0 -> 385HP F250 = 0.4% lower HP/wt
420TQ eco -> 405TQ F250 = 10.2% lower TQ/wt
380TQ 5.0 -> 405TQ F250 = 0.8% lower TQ/wt

So, you can see that even towing, there is a noticeable difference between the eco and 6.2 (particularly TQ) but I've basically stepped back to the equivalent of a 5.0. If you consider the torque curve of the 6.2, it's going to feel better than a 5.0 pulling the same weight.

Now I'll know what your setup feels like compared to an eco:)

[EcoBullet]

fx2tom wrote:

my rear turn signal bulb went out last week.

Darned unreliable Ecoboost trucks!:(

[noteven]

A V12 based on a 2x ECOboost common block, 4 heads, etc would be a nice pickup engine... :C