Taking a breather from rv.net

[bmanning]

I think I need a break; it seems lately that about 2 of 3 threads become argumentative, and the same skillets of hash get reheated over & over: half-ton bashing, Toyota bashing, GVW vs do what you want, get a dually, gas vs diesel, torque vs HP, etc etc

Worst part is that it's brought out negativity in me; over the past few months I've been in a handful of skirmishes and that never used to happen over the first several years I followed this forum.

So call me GSP...I need to step away for a while...if/when I come back it'll be fun to catch up.

In the meantime, enjoy your trucks, campers, and most importantly the people you camp with!

Good luck to you all.

[spoon059]

bigdogger wrote:
Sorry, but I disagree. Your post is a perfect example. I couldn't care less about weights, towing capacity, C channels, Ford vs Dodge vs GM vs the Tucker Torpedo. So what I do is quit reading (and I confess I did that about 1/3 way through your post). I don't threaten to take my ball and go home because I don't like a particular thread or post. Fight all you want about those issues, you lost me at "Ford or Chevy, which ...".
And the people that resort to name calling, threats, and other obnoxious behavior?

That's you and your opinion. You obviously (or hopefully) know enough about your truck and your weights that you don't need to worry about it. My concern is people who don't know these things and are trying to find out. When people give blatantly incorrect information, it is NOT helpful and is downright harmful if someone doesn't know any better and takes the word of some idiot as gospel.

[TomG2]

This thread is another example of the "My way or the highway" attitude of some. Why would someone quit reading a post one third of the way through and then denounce the whole thing? The last two thirds may have agreed with the reader's prejudices and opinions.

[bigdogger]

spoon059 wrote:
With all due respect to bigdogger, I think the OP is talking about the brand bashing, the GVWR bashing, the diesel vs gas bashing.

As long as you are within your weight ratings, any of the manufacturers make a quality product. Playful banter about one truck being "better" than another are one thing, but you have some people that just outright are spreading false information about trucks that they have never owned, never driven, never used to tow, etc. They are incorrectly leading other people astray with false information. Some people love diesel, some people like the convenience of gas. I don't understand why people get so worked up about someone pulling with different technology.

When you have someone come here who legitimately doesn't understand weight ratings and whatnot, its not helpful to spread false information.

Now, I agree with you that its great to hear well thought out arguments supported by fact, measurements, weights, etc. I think a great majority of people here provide useful information that is correct... however there are a LOUD minority that spread lies;

You can't tow ANYTHING with a Tundra, the C-channel frame will snap in half and kill your family.

Anything without a diesel engine is only good for picking up groceries.

The (name any brand specific engine here) will break at the worst time and impregnate your daughter.

6.5 foot beds aren't on real trucks.

8 foot beds are for people who are insecure about genitalia size.

All capacities of a truck are based upon the fully loaded (heaviest) model with the lowest payload.

All capacities of a truck are based upon the stripped down (lightest) model with the highest payload.

Even though my payload is only X, I can tow any weight I want because of Y.

Even though your payload is X, you should NEVER tow anywhere close to that weight and please tell me where you drive so that your inferior truck doesn't have a catastrophic mechanical problem and damage my truck.

That is what is annoying. I enjoy a good discussion as much as anybody, but only if you support your side with fact and truthful information. All the mindless bashing and false information is annoying and potentially damaging to people that don't know better.

That being said, I enjoy about 99% of the threads that I read and am appreciative of the information provided by most of the people here. I have learned things here that I might not have learned, or learned the hard way. I have gotten to share the wealth of knowledge of millions of miles of towing, years of experience and the trials and errors of others.

While I am guilty of following threads off topics at times, I hope that I am not a reason for people's frustrations on this board. I get suckered into the posts that I see possess outright false information and try to set the record straight. I try to ignore most of the ludicrous nonsense... but sometimes I can't help myself.

Sorry, but I disagree. Your post is a perfect example. I couldn't care less about weights, towing capacity, C channels, Ford vs Dodge vs GM vs the Tucker Torpedo. So what I do is quit reading (and I confess I did that about 1/3 way through your post). I don't threaten to take my ball and go home because I don't like a particular thread or post. Fight all you want about those issues, you lost me at "Ford or Chevy, which ...".
And the people that resort to name calling, threats, and other obnoxious behavior? Well it's pretty hard to beat up ole "Bigdogger in Texas". Odds are you will have to go through a few million random fistfights before chance lands you face to face with me, and all the other behaviors just support the fact that the idiot in the discussion is the person they see in the mirror.

[spoon059]

With all due respect to bigdogger, I think the OP is talking about the brand bashing, the GVWR bashing, the diesel vs gas bashing.

As long as you are within your weight ratings, any of the manufacturers make a quality product. Playful banter about one truck being "better" than another are one thing, but you have some people that just outright are spreading false information about trucks that they have never owned, never driven, never used to tow, etc. They are incorrectly leading other people astray with false information. Some people love diesel, some people like the convenience of gas. I don't understand why people get so worked up about someone pulling with different technology.

When you have someone come here who legitimately doesn't understand weight ratings and whatnot, its not helpful to spread false information.

Now, I agree with you that its great to hear well thought out arguments supported by fact, measurements, weights, etc. I think a great majority of people here provide useful information that is correct... however there are a LOUD minority that spread lies;

You can't tow ANYTHING with a Tundra, the C-channel frame will snap in half and kill your family.

Anything without a diesel engine is only good for picking up groceries.

The (name any brand specific engine here) will break at the worst time and impregnate your daughter.

6.5 foot beds aren't on real trucks.

8 foot beds are for people who are insecure about genitalia size.

All capacities of a truck are based upon the fully loaded (heaviest) model with the lowest payload.

All capacities of a truck are based upon the stripped down (lightest) model with the highest payload.

Even though my payload is only X, I can tow any weight I want because of Y.

Even though your payload is X, you should NEVER tow anywhere close to that weight and please tell me where you drive so that your inferior truck doesn't have a catastrophic mechanical problem and damage my truck.

That is what is annoying. I enjoy a good discussion as much as anybody, but only if you support your side with fact and truthful information. All the mindless bashing and false information is annoying and potentially damaging to people that don't know better.

That being said, I enjoy about 99% of the threads that I read and am appreciative of the information provided by most of the people here. I have learned things here that I might not have learned, or learned the hard way. I have gotten to share the wealth of knowledge of millions of miles of towing, years of experience and the trials and errors of others.

While I am guilty of following threads off topics at times, I hope that I am not a reason for people's frustrations on this board. I get suckered into the posts that I see possess outright false information and try to set the record straight. I try to ignore most of the ludicrous nonsense... but sometimes I can't help myself.

[hoopers]

Bob Landry wrote:
No, they are not all like this and they do not have to be. An example is the IDPA Forum. Gun enthusiasts and competition shooters will know what that is. Everyone is required to sign their posts with their real name, either in signature or simply at the end of the post. It keeps everyone civil and what should be a conversation with exchange of ideas does not erupt into a battle. Most important. If someone doesn't have knowledge of the topic, they don't post just for the sake of posting something. Also, the mods keep a very close eye on it and squabbles simply are not allowed to manifest into a full scale fight.

Having strong moderators does help for sure. I do think this forum is better than most, though obviously, there are those who have gotten upset. IMHO, until it happens to you, it is easy to dismiss it as trivial. Again, this is just my opinion.

I do know of three cases...not this forum. None of them involved me directly, but I participated in the forums, so saw much of it first hand.

Once case, physical violence was threatened. Several posters were claiming they were going to visit an individual's house and beat them to a pulp. That is how mad those people got... The threatened person hired an attorney to go after those individuals. Took them to court claiming harassment and did get some type of restraining order. I never heard what the settlement was, but I do know the arguments stopped. And all that sprung from just postings on a forum.

Another example I witnessed involved a forum founder, who was continually harassed and called names. This went on for a year or so. The individuals would simply change their user names and continue. Eventually, the forum had to be shut down.

[fj12ryder]

Nicely put.

[bigdogger]

I couldn't disagree with the original post more. I have no interest in any forum where someone posts their thoughts and then all the following posts simply say they agree. Even in the RVing forums, there are many issues and positions that people can reasonably disagree with. Boondockers and Resort RVers are diametrically opposed in how they RV. Impassioned arguments on both sides of an issue are helpful. I was engaged on a thread recently where the issue was renting out your sticks and bricks house while full-timing. Fact of the matter is there are very strong arguments pro and con. If it wasn't for an enthusiastic conversation between supporters of both sides, the poster might not get complete information.
When people get testy, I feel it conveys the fact that they have deeply set beliefs, and that is important to know. Even when one party starts to get personal in their attacks, you learn something, because we all know that some people feel that if they can't attack the message, they must resort to attacking the messenger.

[goducks10]

How long before this thread is closed? I'm surprised it hasn't gone off topic yet.

[Bob_Landry]

No, they are not all like this and they do not have to be. An example is the IDPA Forum. Gun enthusiasts and competition shooters will know what that is. Everyone is required to sign their posts with their real name, either in signature or simply at the end of the post. It keeps everyone civil and what should be a conversation with exchange of ideas does not erupt into a battle. Most important. If someone doesn't have knowledge of the topic, they don't post just for the sake of posting something. Also, the mods keep a very close eye on it and squabbles simply are not allowed to manifest into a full scale fight.

[hoopers]

dreeder wrote:
It is what it is, all public forums have these issues, this forum is very mild in my opinion. Most people on here seem to be pretty polite. Of course threads like 1/2 ton vs 3/4 ton or gas vs. diesel are very opinionated and get out of line sometimes but thats just the way it is, no harm is actually done.
Most of the time when I see someone announce that they are leaving a forum it is because they get so frustrated that there opinion doesn't matter as much as they think it should, they take their ball and go home.

X2. Many, but not all, public forums I have seen are all like this. There are always some people who want to write nasty responses to others. I have seen forums where it is a LOT worse, where posters have actually hired attorneys to go after others because of postings. Threats of violence etc.
Best to just read and only post when you have something useful to say.

[rowekmr]

To the OP I hope to see you back, I can recall you among others in this thread having some informative posts. This site was really invaluable to me when I got into RV'ing and now it has helped me with several TV issues.

Lately I have also noticed the decorum going down lately but I guess it is just a sign of the times as people face more pressures/stress in their lives there has to be somewhere were they can vent. There is nothing wrong with disagreeing even if both sides "think" they have the facts. In the end we have to remember that most of us love this hobby/passion/lifestyle foremost and which brand vehicle, tire, or even diesel vs gas is just secondary banter. I hope I didn't step on anyone's toes.

[sidney]

I went away for a couple of hours. :B

[JustLabs]

I used to post a couple times per day. In 2012 I took a break and didn't post for about 9 months.

Now I post once or twice a month. Too many know-it-alls and dudes that want to argue just to argue anymore.

[bmanning]

Steve S wrote:
Oh pleeeaasssee don't single me out, I was just pointing out that you sound like you're looking for a shoulder to cry on.
I'm still trying to figure out why you started this thread?
Do you feel like your being ignored?

You're being childish but I'm not taking the bait my friend.

Hey maybe I've turned a corner already!

If I was feeling ignored (which I really wasn't but it's ok to speculate) the PMs I've received would've extinguished that. Lots of very, very good people on this forum, which I knew but the PMs and some of the posts in this thread reinforced that.

I sincerely wish you a good weekend Steve. You're probably a really good dude in person; everyone I've ever met from Canada has been a pleasure to be around.