Torque converter lockup

[bovellois]

I have a 97 Dodge Ram 2500. I am wondering if the lockup mechanism of the torque converter is submerged in oil or dry. I tend to believe it's in oil, and if so, does that contribute to slippage?

[oldbeek]

bovellois wrote:
Thanks all. Yes, the engine is turned up with torque plate 8. I have replaced the TC with a stronger after market. I have installed the BD Performance pressure modifier that increases pressure at low RPM. I am the only driver and watch very carefully for slippage when I tow, and slippage very seldom occurs (only when cruise control makes the Cummins get out of hand in steep slopes... I then make a habit of deactivating it to prevent the risk of slippage). The lubricant is perfectly clean after 50k highway miles since new TC and oil. I was just curious about the clutch mechanism, since it's impossible to peek inside. It makes sense that clutch wear material be carried in the oil instead of build up inside the TC.

To the question about miles, 220k. Transmission works like new, never abused, replaced original TC with billet TC at 185k. I also have the BD Performance pressure control kit Click. Next job is a Transgo TFOD Diesel VB kit installation.

You may want to look at the BD valve body that provides 2nd gear lock up. No slippage and heat when pulling or descending in 2nd.

[bovellois]

smkettner wrote:
Fluid goes right to the clutch.

Excellent illustration, thanks. Most are too simplistic to show fluid flow.

[bovellois]

Thanks all. Yes, the engine is turned up with torque plate 8. I have replaced the TC with a stronger after market. I have installed the BD Performance pressure modifier that increases pressure at low RPM. I am the only driver and watch very carefully for slippage when I tow, and slippage very seldom occurs (only when cruise control makes the Cummins get out of hand in steep slopes... I then make a habit of deactivating it to prevent the risk of slippage). The lubricant is perfectly clean after 50k highway miles since new TC and oil. I was just curious about the clutch mechanism, since it's impossible to peek inside. It makes sense that clutch wear material be carried in the oil instead of build up inside the TC.

To the question about miles, 220k. Transmission works like new, never abused, replaced original TC with billet TC at 185k. I also have the BD Performance pressure control kit Click. Next job is a Transgo TFOD Diesel VB kit installation.

[Me_Again]

bovellois wrote:
I have a 97 Dodge Ram 2500. I am wondering if the lockup mechanism of the torque converter is submerged in oil or dry. I tend to believe it's in oil, and if so, does that contribute to slippage?

Dodge never used a very good TC with their diesel auto trucks. To high of a stall speed. Also they lacked computer control to keep the TC locked when you let up on the throttle. So you need an external control to lock it for an exhaust brake. How many miles on the tranny? Do you tow heavy? I quality builder can provide you with a much stronger custom tranny. Triple disc TCers are good in many cases for the torque of the Cummins. Do you have the engine turned up?

Chris

[noteven]

bovellois wrote:
I have a 97 Dodge Ram 2500. I am wondering if the lockup mechanism of the torque converter is submerged in oil or dry. I tend to believe it's in oil, and if so, does that contribute to slippage?

No - oil present on a clutch designed to be a "wet clutch" will not contribute to slippage.

[Eng208]

It locks up and is not supposed to slip, hence the phrase "lock up". If it is slipping when locked up, the tranny will be contaminated with TC debris. This debris is what clogs fluid passages and leads to complete tranny failure. I had a 97 that suffered TC failure after a long trip with a toy hauler after changing the fuel plate. I was able to salvage the tranny by replacing the valve body and TC with a Goerend unit. I also replaced the 1-2 shift lever and front clutch pack at that time. I flushed the complete tranny and cooler and didn't have any other issues in the next 50K miles. It was very tight when locked up.
In regards to your question whether it is in fluid or not, I would have to say it is in fluid. The entire tranny and torque converter works off of hydraulic principles and tranny fluid comes in contact with everything inside.

[time2roll]

Fluid goes right to the clutch.

[hmknightnc]

When the torque converter is "locked" there is no slippage, it's a mechanical connection. Yes, it is in oil.

[bovellois]

Old-Biscuit wrote:
Torque converter...LINK

"To counter this effect, some cars have a torque converter with a lockup clutch. When the two halves of the torque converter get up to speed, this clutch locks them together, eliminating the slippage and improving efficiency."

No info about whether the clutch material operates in a dry or wet environment.

[Old-Biscuit]

Torque converter...LINK