Disabled Parking Permits

[loulou57]

In Ontario we get 50% off provincial park campgrounds if you have a valid Ontario disabled parking permit. You also do not require a fishing license. Odd, I know.

I have one. I have been asked on so many occasions, why do you have that, you look fine, what's your problem?

My hubby and I have been yelled at, cursed at and given the unofficial universal sign language on many occasions.

I do not use a disabled spot if there are only a couple of them. I always think someone may come in with a wheelchair and need the space.
Also in the campground, if I am assigned the disabled Site, I always say if someone comes in with a wheelchair we will move to another Site. Just because we get the discount does not mean we have to use a disabled Site, we can use any we choose.

I am not a senior, I do not use a wheelchair and my disability is not always noticeable.

Why do people think it is their right to harass myself and others. They think I owe them an explanation.

It is illegal for anyone, a security person, parking attendant or even a police officer to ask me why I have a permit and demand an answer.

Has anyone else had this issue? What do you do?

We have found that when someone says...do you realize that this parking spot is for a disabled person, I answer, yes I do.

We have been followed into the store with someone yelling at us the whole way into a store, only to have the manager come and say...you really need to move your truck, you obviously have no disability. Another time someone added to his non verbal words that if I could drive a truck I had no disability....Really???

[SRT]

amandasgramma wrote:
I have a disabled permit but have had little need for it in the last few years. I, too, had a "hidden" disability and have been harassed. One time I just looked back at the person for a full minute without responding and then quietly said "I see you, too, have a disability that normally doesn't bare itself to society". The person got a confused look on his face and asked what I meant.......I said "you're an imbecile....which can't be cured. I'm praying mine can be cured".....and I walked away.

I'm also praying that they get a cure for my lung disease (IPF, "only" 200,000 are diagnosed each year)). Rotten stuff, but at least I have an oxygen tube going to my nose now that shows that I'm handicapped. My handicapped sticker is good to 2019, so I'm hopping for a cure.

[TenOC]

My DW has a Disable permit. Some days she can only walk a few feet. Other days she can walk longer. When she is OK we do NOT use the permit. Other day we do.

My Sister is in a wheelchair 100% of the time. She always uses the permit because she need to extra room to get in and out of the van.

My suggestion. Most of us need the exercise of walking in the parking lot. The permit is for people who REALLY NEED it. Because you have a permit does not "REQUIRE" you to use it.

If you use it when you do not need it, maybe God will think you want to be able to use it all the time. . . . :S

[ol__yeller]

I have Hcap plate on my car and a hanger tag to take with me if someone else is driving. My disability is also not apparent at first glance. After a heart attack and serious after effects I am left with half of a functioning heart and a seriously compromised electrical system. I also have a nice car but I don't know what that has to do with the question(bowling alley post). I have never been questioned in 4 years by anyone about my using a Hcap space. I don't doubt it happens but when it does happen to me I will just tell them to mind their own business and go on my way. If they feel compelled to call the police then, I can show the cop my wallet card which proves I am the one the placard was issued to.

If I am having a good day (not as often as you might think) I will park elsewhere. Also if there are only a few spots open and I am feeling good, I will park elsewhere. If my wife and I are together and she leaves me in the car, we park elsewhere. Having a Hcap permit carries the responsibility to use it correctly. Being handicapped myself showed me that one needs to be considerate and respectful of others who may be worse off than me. Karma will catch up with those who are cheating the system. When I first got the permit I was surprised at how many flagrant violators there were of the Hcap parking spaces. Now after 4 years I realize that most have just forgotten to put up their placard.

My state also gives a 50% discount to handicapped campers at state parks. I appreciate the gesture and have taken advantage of it in the past. While some sites are labelled handicapped there are no differences between them and others that make them particularly accessible.

[raindove]

loulou57 wrote:
Not looking to argue here, just having a discussion on difference of opinions..;)

The fella again with the knee...LOL! Now I don't know the man obviously but I am one to always look at both sides.

We seldom know how much pain etc someone is in or can deal with. Before my injury/illness I questioned in my mind about a person on disability with a bad back but I would see him push a lawnmower, carry his grandchildren and yes help do his roof. I thought to myself what a fake. :R

It all changed for me one day. I now wear 150mcg of Fentanyl just to be able to function due to pain. (look up the strength of it compared to morphine). Sometimes if I do something more than basically get up and spend 15 minutes doing something I will be bed bound for a few days or in hospital.
I won't drag this out but one of my goals was to do a 10 mile hike in Europe at a special spot. I did it, practically crawled the last mile, LOL but I did it. Took lots of meds to do it and I paid.
People see me out on good days, seldom a bad. My condition can change hourly. When I can I hike, sometimes with canes. I always use a cart shopping, not for stuff but for me to lean on for support. This is why you may see me need a parking spot one day but not another, :h the days I push myself I think there is someone who needs that spot today more than me.
Through all the therapy and treatments I have had I was encouraged to push myself. I do. I was put on 100% disability through workers compensation and our government disability. I work in my garden, 15 minutes to a half hour, then in to lay down. I camp, canoe, hike but no longer can I lift a grandchild.
The point is to look at me when you would see me, anyone would think there is nothing wrong. However, if you were on "my side" of me you would definitely know things are drastically wrong. 😞
I just find it hard to believe that people would try to fake an illness, but better yet to be able to convince a DR they had something wrong just to be able to save a few steps.
Since that day 25 years ago, I no longer judge the man with the bad back who is carrying his grandchildren. I say...good for him for trying.
As I said, not trying to argue with you, just giving another
opinion :)o

Very well put. I am in basically the same position. I do things with my grandchildren - but I have to push myself to the limits, load up on pain meds, and I still pay.
The 10 yr old is able and willing to pick the bolos up off the ground for me. He knows if he wants me to play ladder golf or whatever it's called, he has to help.

My GK's are bigger - 10, 18, 20, & 23 so lifting them not an issue. I do have a Great-GK on the way. I'm figuring if I sit in a rocker, I will be able to have someone hand the baby to me, and I can at least rock it while it's small. 😄

I never have a good day, but some are better than others. If there is a non-HC space close by, I save the HC for someone who may be worse than me. I too, have endured the looks, stares, comments, etc.

I try not to judge others. I would rather let someone slide that may be cheating the system, rather than make someone legitimately using the spot feel bad. Many disabilities are invisible.

I truly believe in Karma. What goes around comes around and eventually they get theirs. It may not always happen as fast as you would like to see, but sometimes you are lucky enough to be around to see it play out.

[RetSgt7114]

The simple explanation to the OP's original post was answered by TusconJim. There is an awful lot of fraud and abuse being perpetrated by people who do not have a legitimate disability & it causes others to be suspect. More often than not it's a family member that takes advantage of a disabled persons HC permit, even though the disabled person is not actually in the vehicle or being driven. I'm not saying that it's right to be know what one's disability is, but I do believe that there is some value in people asking the question. If you're legitimately disabled, don't be offended, it could be a positive because it may cause an abuser to think twice about taking up a spot for someone that truly needs one, such as yourself. If I were disabled, I think that I would respond to a challenge by saying that I was in fact legitimately disabled (without saying what), and leave it at that. No need to get offended because ultimately is your interest that is being protected. Many people are ignorant as to what a disabled person should look like (think blue stick-figure guy in a wheelchair), so I don't think that they're trying to be mean, I think that they just don't know.

[Dog_Folks]

Bumpyroad wrote:
I was thinking about getting one of those canes with a built in taser to chase away stray dogs. maybe I'll get one to chase away people who can't MYOB>
bumpy

Where is the "like" button. I want one.

[Bumpyroad]

I was thinking about getting one of those canes with a built in taser to chase away stray dogs. maybe I'll get one to chase away people who can't MYOB>
bumpy

[Dog_Folks]

loulou57 wrote:


I have one. I have been asked on so many occasions, why do you have that, you look fine, what's your problem?

My hubby and I have been yelled at, cursed at and given the unofficial universal sign language on many occasions.

Why do people think it is their right to harass myself and others. They think I owe them an explanation.

Has anyone else had this issue? What do you do?

If they ask my response is: "Geez, you don't look like a doctor, show me your credentials and we can discuss it."

It they yell,I ignore them. If they choose to get physical, a cane upside the head works well.

What do they get out of such behavior? They can feel self important for a few minutes.

I don't put up with any of this. I am too old, and now, too disabled to do so. They can find something else to focus their tirades upon.

As for the manager that questioned you, here in the US they cannot legally ask but a very few carefully worded questions. If they did to me what you describe I would have their job, if not their store. After all I am retired and now disabled, and have nothing else to do but push the issue.

Call me "aggressive" if you will. I prefer "fed up."

[Leeblev]

In CA, not only do you have a "hanger" but you can obtain plates. I chose the hanger because i use two cars and my MH. When you get the permit, you also get a "registration" that stays in the vehicle. In my case, I copied the permit and put a copy in each vehicle. Never had a problem, although I have been asked if I was aware that the space I was about to park in was handicapped. Here, there is a number on the hanger that LEO can call in to see who is permitted. Doesn't say what the disability is , just who has the permit. When I am in another persons car, I take my permit, but not the "registration".
In my case, I have had THREE hip replacements, Myasthenia Gravis and circulation issues. At the present time, I walk well and don't seem to be having any difficulty getting around. However, I can exit my vehicle, go into a store and suddenly "crash". Getting back to my vehicle can become a chore. So, as previously posted, just because someone looks healthy and hale, doesn't necessarily mean a thing.
As a former LEO, I am very aware of the abuse I see daily with the permits and laud officers for checking permits when they feel it is necessary. I think the fine for abuse is not adequate, although here the hanger is confiscated and a ticket issued. Of course, that affects the legitimate users ability to get around.
I don't mind if someone asks me if I need the permit. I would be offended if they started yelling at me. However, I would take into consideration their ignorance and lack of class for doing so.

[rovinredneck]

I bowl on a seniors league during the day....I have to laugh watching the old folks grab the handicap spots.. some corvettes, some miatas. One man is 96, and he doesn't have a plague or tag....An inspiration to all of us (I'm 78)not putting anyone down. some are wives or bowlers some are hubbies. and lots of walkers. love 'em all.

[ReadyToGo]

Well the law in Mn is clear. To park in the handicap spot you need to be in the car when it is parked.
If you are driving someone else and drop them off at the door, you are not authorized to park in the handicap spot, even though you have a sticker or plate. Of course no one hardly ever follows this rule.

[et2]

This is a subject that will always get responses from both sides. As many have indicated a disability doesn't mean its noticeable. One doesn't have to be in a wheel chair, walking with a Cain or walker, or limping. Many disabilities are unseen. My wife is one. She has more than one health issue that makes it hard for her to do things you and I take for granted. Cancer is one. On her better days she parks like everyone else. On the bad days she righty uses her handicap.

She has more than once ( usually at Costco for some reason) been verbally abused and yelled at by other people ( usually men). I wish for one time they would say something while I'm with her.

Sure it gets abused, and that is a problem. All I have to say is there is someone always thinking they are better than everyone else and will put themselves above everyone no matter what. I don't hear people complain about those who park right in front of the store clearly marked no parking and run inside to "grab something", all the while pedestrians and cars have to negotiate around them.

People using a handicap spot, we never question it as you never know. If you're using it illegally you a lazy inconsiderate bum. I think handicap people get abused by people more then someone abusing the privilege.

[azrving]

puttd wrote:
I have a disability not necessarily obvious on some days, use a placard, and anyone who yells at me is engaging in disorderly conduct and possibly assault, and is not protecting handicapped rights, which includes my right to live in peace. If you yell at me like a crazy person, I will call the police and I will press charges.

And as for the "obvious" violations. People would think that of my mother, driving the international that was my parents tow vehicle. She would often have people come huffing in her direction, until she'd drop the walker out the driver's side, lower herself down, and head into Kmart. Someone bench pressing 250 might have problems with their legs. And news flash, disabled people go the the gym. On doctor's orders, in many instances. So, unless you are being a creepy stalker guy following someone around you don't really know.

And, I look perfectly fine. My legs last only so long. I have literally put my hip out because I couldn't handle the wait in line at wally world and ended up in bed for a week. Hopped out of the store on one leg gripping the cart because I could put no weight on the bad hip. Was glad the car wasn't parked in the hinterlands

Lol. I would like to watch your mother in action. You are right though. I'm 60 and kick butt all day long working around the house and on my RV. Only problem is every now and then my right hip will sort of give out and it has at times made me feel as if I'm about to collapse. My buddy had the same issue and ended up with a hip replacement. Its like being young and complaining about old people, someday you will be one. Well in this case someday we may be hanging a handicapped tag on the mirror too! They should be careful as Murphy may dish it up sooner rather than later.

[rwbradley]

This is truly a distasteful thread. As an observer please keep in mind:
1) it is none of your business
2) it is REALLY none of your business
3) there are many hundreds of inflammatory and neurological diseases that flare up ie Arthritis and MS. While we may go days, weeks or months without symptoms, when they appear they can be horrifically crippling and painful. Try being under 40 with an invisible disability very few people will believe you.
4) if you think someone is abusing the system call the police, they have the authority to verify the owner of a disability sticker/card. But make awful damn sure you right. Are there abusers, ya probably but should that 1 out of 100 give everyone else a bad name... no. People abuse all kinds of rules ie the teen mother on welfare living in subsidized housing and lets her working boyfriend move in, or how about that person who always takes 10, 11 or 12 items in the 8 items or less line?
5) is there grey area? yes some doctors are more liberal, some patients have higher pain thresholds, some people only have symptoms sometimes. Is that a reason to paint everyone with an invisible disability with the same brush? NO!

The point:
1) only a doctor can decide who can have a disability card, and they do not have to disclose that info to someone in the parking lot who is mad that they had to walk from the back of the lot.
2) only the police/parking enforcement can enforce the use of the cards, not someone in the parking lot who is mad that they had to walk from the back of the lot.
3) only you can not judge someone with a disability.

To the OP: suggest anyone who gives you attitude about it, in you most friendly and polite voice that they call the police if they think a law has been broken. An other option is to suggest to the person in your most friendly and polite voice that their prejudice toward people with invisible disabilities is unflattering. You would be shocked how many people with attitudes about this will shut up and crawl under a rock after being called a bigot by someone with a disability.

[wa8yxm]

This I know: Some folks can look healthy as a horse and still be disabled, For example there were two periods in my own life where I could only walk a short distance.. The distance from my RV to the laundry room in the park, for example.. I had to sit down half way and rest a while (Thankfully that one only lasted about a week.. And I know the cause (I had just gotten out of hospital where I spent a week) 2 weeks later at a follow up Doctor's appointment I parked the car at the hospital and checked into the cafiteria for some brunch and Wi-Fi (bad but better than park) and when it came time for lunch and the Cafiteria filled up I checked out and walked the half mile to the Doctor's instead of driving.. kind of impressed the doc it did. nice walk, Decent weather, Cool but not cold,, I like that time of year.


And back around 1998 I had bad neuropathy (Still do but it's settled down) and walking was PAINFUL. Again, I had to break up long walks.. When shopping a "Super store" (THink Wal*Mart though i tend to avoid them there are others). I'd pick up the first loose shopping cart in the lot and use is as a "Walker".. i still do, only now it is for a different reason (Courtesy, saves the store picking it up).

but through all this I look healthy, no cane, no cast, no wheelchair.

A friend of mine,, often could run around almost as good as a child,, Those were his good days.

His bad days.. He could not walk at all.

HOW TO TELL if someone is really handicapped:

The truly handicapped come in two types: Some are handicapped all the time, Example is someone in a chair.. They may use handicapped license plates. but the ambulatory handicapped who have good and bad days.. They use hang tags.

On a good day the hang tag goes in the glove box and they save the handicapped site for those who need it.

On a bad day.. They need it.

Sounds like the Original Poster is that kind.. on a good day the hang tag does not hang. on a bad day they need it.

Now... Those who are not really handicapped: I know one woman who's mother qualified as Disabled (And for good reason I might add) She would take her mother shopping and such, so she had the hang tag in her car, she would use it even when she did NOT have her mother with her. Even though she was more mobile than I am... She used a scooter in the campground, Even though I walk and she is less handicapped than I am (Well on a bad day I take the bicycle cause i can ride when I can not walk.. Yes, i understand why, plus I kind of like riding the bike).