How much engine to tow 5500 lbs?

[marquette]

My wife and I are looking to buy a used 19-22 ft 5th wheel. Weight range from 35-4000 dry so I am figuring 5-5500 lbs wet weight. I have already decided the TV has to be a 3/4 ton with either a extended or crew cab. Budget wise I am looking at 1998-2004 trucks. In the trucks I have looked at Chevy has the venerable 5.7 or the 5.3 or 6.0., Dodge the gas 5.9 or Ford has the 5.4 or 6.8 V10. I have looked at the paper statistics of all of them but would like to hear some real world experience of what works. I will tow mostly midwest, Dakotas, and New England. Probably about 5000 miles a year. I am not interested in a diesel.

[APT]

The replacement for displacement is and has always been forced induction. In the full sized truck market, there have not been factory forced induction gas engines until 2011 Ford Ecoboost. In the price range and therefore age range of 10-15 year old trucks, big blocks rule. Towing fuel consumption is the same as small blocks.

[Fordlover]

marquette wrote:
It seems like with everything they have done to engines the manufactures still can't get past the old adage that there is no replacement for displacement....The 6.8 and 8.1 are probably overkill and use more gas but will not even be close to their potential so will be more relaxing to drive.

I guess that just depends on your perspective. I have no problem revving an engine past 3K RPM. I wouldn't avoid buying a V10, but I wouldn't buy it because I'm afraid of seeing RPM's above idle.

This is music to my ears at 16,000 RPM.

[BenK]

"......but will not even be close to their potential so will be more relaxing to drive....."

and more fun to drive...enjoy mine IMMENSELY. My Sub is no longer my daily and
only drive on trips needing the capacity or just to keep the fluids flowing on
weekends

[marquette]

It seems like with everything they have done to engines the manufactures still can't get past the old adage that there is no replacement for displacement. After reading all the input it seems the big blocks still produce their torque at low rpm's and the small blocks produce their torque at high rpm. So a 5.3, 5.4 or a 6.0 will need to get up to 35-4500 rpm to pull while a 8.1 or 6.8 will do the same at 2500 rpm. It sounds like the 5.3 and 5.4 will work but be on the edge of their comfort zone. The 6.0 may be the best compromise between power and economy. The 6.8 and 8.1 are probably overkill and use more gas but will not even be close to their potential so will be more relaxing to drive.

[MattINW]

Power wise the Ford 5.4 from 2001 was a gutless wonder, in I think 2004 they upped the HP which helped alot. It is a reliable engine though even if the one with low HP.

In general, I ere on having a larger engine for towing/hauling even if worse fuel economy. But that's just me.

[BenK]

It is all about opinions...

I like'm all (am a gear head), but prefer a big block if given a choice

Personally don't like high rev'ing TV ICEs...GREAT in my 2 seater, but
not any of my trucks. When my 1980 Silverado dies...going to look for
a 1950's pickup. Dually if find one, but for sure a 3/4 ton and will
'settle' for a half ton. In line Six desired and will have forced
feed it. Of course manual tranny and 2WD is okay too

Most all will 'get the job done', but some better than others...most of the bigger
will last longer as the OP has noted, but NOT because of their 'solid body'...as
half ton's normally use the exact same body as their bigger cousins

They are NOT as highly stressed (most times) as half tons

A 2015 2.7L Ecoboost would probably eat up the 8.1L/V10 from 10 years ago

Yup...as forced fed similar/same amounts of air/fuel as big blocks...so they have
similar power curves married with newer IP for overall higher performance 'capabilities'

[marquette]

This is good stuff to know. I had a 5.7 in a Tahoe and at best it was Ok but since it is out there I included it but I agree it won't be my first choice. I have seen a couple of the Ford V-10's on the lots and plan to drive one this weekend. Lots of 5.3 and 5.4"s so knowing how they stack up is important info. 6.0's are about as common as the Ford V-10 but I have not seen a Dodge V-10 even listed anywhere. The only 8.1 I have seen is in a 2500HD crew cab with a fairly solid body but it has 246,000 miles on it for $5000. Just not sure about that many miles. It seems 3/4 and 1 ton trucks tend to run much higher miles than 1/2 ton for the same price but I assume it's because most are bought as work trucks and not grocery getters. 1 ton gassers seem to be priced about the same as 3/4 ton. I saw a 1 ton listed with a 5.4 fairly reasonable but I didn't even go look at it because I figured with the weight of just the truck a 5.4 wouldn't get the job done. I haven't driven a Dodge 5.9 yet because up here in Minnesota rust is a problem and I haven't seen a Dodge yet I couldn't see threw. I don't need to win any races but I do want to be able to go down the freeway at 60 mph without the engine screaming for mercy.

[APT]

DougE wrote:
It sure didn't take long for the "Ya gotta have a big rig" guys to jump in. The PO is looking to travel the Midwest and New England so doesn't NEED anything so stout and expensive to run.

I had a 1999 F-150 that would have done fine for OP. I towed 6500 pound TT with a 2003 F-150 as well. But power and gearing in that era was far worse than today's trucks. A 2015 2.7L Ecoboost would probably eat up the 8.1L/V10 from 10 years ago. But OP isn't spending $40k+ on a new truck. Power from small blocks 15 years ago is adequate at best while towing with 3 usable gears. Towing fuel consumption is the same as more powerful gas options. OP noted 5000 miles per year, so not a weekender. There are hills in Michigan I that I needed second gear at 4500rpm for with my 5.4L. The V10 and 8.1L would provide a more pleasant towing experience. If the use case is more towing and not much highway unloaded, the overkill compromise is not important.

GM's 6.0L used the same amount of fuel as that era 5.3L. No reason not to get the extra 10% more power. The GM 5.7L was a dog. Dodge 5.7L is worth looking at, but I'm not sure what years to start trusting the trans, maybe 2004+.

[NC_Hauler]

MFL wrote:

NC Hauler wrote:

dodge guy wrote:
Any of the current 1/2 tons is more than you need. a 5th wheel the size you are thinking has a small frontal area. any o the V-8`s will do just fine.

If you want a 3/4 ton, I`de go with the Ford with the V-10 or the Dodge with the 5.9 or 5.7L. Chevy with the 6.0L is the only choice.

Actually for the years OP is talking, 1998 to 2004', as far as Chevy/GM goes, the 6.0 isn't the only choice...as stated, 5.7 and the 8.1 were available during those years...Having towed the same 5er through the mountains with a 2003 6.0 and the 2001 8.1....though the 8.1 is a gas guzzler, the 6.0 couldn't compete with the 8.1 strapped to an Allison....the 8.1 was the only gasser back then put out by GM/Chevy that came with the Allison, (other than the Duramax), to me that's a BIG plus , ( of course mpg was a big minus).

Jim, I think the GM 5.7 was left out as an option, due to the low torque/low HP. It is dependable, like the Ford 2v 5.4, but down on towing power.

Jerry

Gotcha Jerry, thanks buddy:)

[NC_Hauler]

DougE wrote:
It sure didn't take long for the "Ya gotta have a big rig" guys to jump in. The PO is looking to travel the Midwest and New England so doesn't NEED anything so stout and expensive to run.

Hey, we were tossing out engine sizes..What's the big deal? Some happened to think of V-10's, I happened to think of the v8-8.1 liter...."Don't recollect anyone saying to the OP, "ya gotta have a big rig":h Really??? Some of us stated he could probably get by with a 1/2 ton truck...far from BIG RIG, as is the 2500....we were throwing out more options for gas engines...What do you think the cost on any 2500 from 98' through 04' with any of the gassers that were mentioned would cost??? Will agree that several that were "tossed out there " would cost more to run...but again, tossing out some options..Don't really see anything wrong with that..

[NC_Hauler]

Bionic Man wrote:

NC Hauler wrote:

Bionic Man wrote:
Since no one has touched on the Dodge, I will. If looking that way, I would try to find the V10 - it will pull every bit as hard as the Chevy 8.1 or the Ford V10.

I had a 5.9 in a short bed regular cab 1500, about a 1995 vintage. Was a good truck, and did fine pulling a 4400 pound boat, but that is a lot easier to pull than a 5er. I think the 5.9 would be comparable to the Chevy 5.7, or the Ford 5.4, but is limited to around 230 HP (memory, could be a little higher).

Long story short, go with the V10 or find a little newer 5.7 Hemi. Much better towing options.

Wasn't trying to cut on any one vehicle...I don't know about the Ford V10 nor the Dodge V10..I merely brought up the 8.1 from owning one and it hadn't been mentioned up to that point. What were the specs on the Dodge V10 engine...just curious..

310/450

Horsepower sure has changed in modern engines.

Gotcha...the 8.1 in my truck was rated at 340/455....both real close.

[DougE]

It sure didn't take long for the "Ya gotta have a big rig" guys to jump in. The PO is looking to travel the Midwest and New England so doesn't NEED anything so stout and expensive to run.

[blt2ski]

THe vortec 454 for what it is worth, is a 295/440 motor vs the specs given of the 8.1. The 8.1 has more umph. The V5700, is a 255/330 motor. With the 4l80E and 4.1's, will do ok with up to 6klbs of trailer depending upon what speeds you want to go. BUT, If I could find an 2001+ gm with the 8.1, ally and 4.10s, that would be my FIRST choice if GM ends up being the choice of truck.

The 1500HD with the 6.0 from 01 up is a true 3/4 ton truck. Badged a half ton. Also a good choice. The 6.0 does have more hp than the 454 did, but still a bit less than the 8.1.

Marty

[Bionic_Man]

NC Hauler wrote:

Bionic Man wrote:
Since no one has touched on the Dodge, I will. If looking that way, I would try to find the V10 - it will pull every bit as hard as the Chevy 8.1 or the Ford V10.

I had a 5.9 in a short bed regular cab 1500, about a 1995 vintage. Was a good truck, and did fine pulling a 4400 pound boat, but that is a lot easier to pull than a 5er. I think the 5.9 would be comparable to the Chevy 5.7, or the Ford 5.4, but is limited to around 230 HP (memory, could be a little higher).

Long story short, go with the V10 or find a little newer 5.7 Hemi. Much better towing options.

Wasn't trying to cut on any one vehicle...I don't know about the Ford V10 nor the Dodge V10..I merely brought up the 8.1 from owning one and it hadn't been mentioned up to that point. What were the specs on the Dodge V10 engine...just curious..

310/450

Horsepower sure has changed in modern engines.