Paid for but vacant sites

[BluStem]

Most state parks in Iowa consider a site occupied if it's payed for.
I find out from co-workers that some public parks they have been to require a payed site to be occupied with a camper or someone else can take it. I maintain if a site is payed for then it should be yours regardless if you have a unit on it or not. Why wouldn't it?

[rockhillmanor]

Kentucky Horse Park CG Lexington KY
When you check in you are given an 8 x10 sheet of paper with your arrival date and departure date.

At the front of each CG site is a big wooden post and a clip, you clip your info sheet to the post.

Doesn't get much simpler than that.

After reading the posts in this thread......
Apparently, what seems to be mostly out west, is the "first-come" "first-serve" way of camping at CG's where reserving without paying is a procedure where unscrupulous reserving practices seem to abound. Which are what most posts/complaints are about.
I personally as a full timer have never even seen a CG like that.

IMHO, JMHO I would not waste one minute of my time or energy on ANY park that was first come first serve.

After reading all the personal experiences, accusations, and criminal actions done to each other by the campers staying in the CG, these first come parks sound more like a war zone certainly not a peaceful CG. :R

[Javi1]

Not sure how it is selfish to pay for something, must be from another generation or another planet.

[MitchF150]

rhagfo wrote:

MitchF150 wrote:
I think our State Park says you have until the next day by 1pm to occupy or notify them that you still want the site or they will open it up for the next available camper. Oh, and no refund either...

What's been going on with our parks is the reservation system allows you to reserve up to 9 mos ahead of time for up to 10 consecutive days. What people started doing was reserving a site up to 7 days prior to their actual intended arrival date so they get first shot on a Fri-Sun site. After a week or so, they would cancel the prior 7 days and just keep the weekend dates they really wanted, but didn't have to fight to get it reserved, which can happen if you did it 9 mos to that Fri arrival date.

They have to pay a $7 cancel fee, but got refunded for the canceled days.

This year, I think they caught onto this as there is a new policy on cancellations where they will have to pay up to 50% of the canceled days..

Hopefully, this will keep those folks from reserving earlier dates just to cancel them to get the actual dates they want.

To the OP, I feel that if you are indeed going to use the site for the days you reserved for, or are willing to pay for the days you aren't going to be there, at least call the park so they know you won't be checking in until whenever, but you'd still like the site for when you do arrive and understand that you are still paying for the days you are not there..

Mitch

I had to read that three time to understand what you were getting at!
Basically they were reserving the weekend 9 months and 5 days in advance.

Sorry yes, it makes better sense when you get screwed out of a site when you try to reserve 9 mos to the Friday you want in.. What someone has done is reserve that same site 5-7 days PRIOR to my even trying to reserve it thru the same weekend I want it. Then they simply cancel the previous 5-7 days a bit after their reservation is accepted. They get their CC charged for the full 10 days at the time of reservation. If they cancel, they pay a small cancel fee and get the rest of the canceled days as a refund.

I have no problem with someone reserving a site for 10 days if they are willing to pay for the full 10 days, whether or not they are physically there or not because they only want it for the weekend.

For this year, what they have done is ruin the cancellation rule for those folks that actually have a legitimate reason for cancelling... Now, those folks that are forced to cancel because of a change in plans or whatever, they now must pay up to 50% of the original reserved days, just as they will have to do if they are only reserving extra days to get the weekend days they really want.

Anyway, it's a game and I choose not to play.. I did get to the campgrounds I wanted to, but did not get my favorite sites.. My choice, I know, but I'm glad the new rules are in place now, even if it will cost me more to cancel, if it comes to that... Another example of people taking advantage of a rule to suit them, but ends up hurting others in the end..

Mitch

[pappcam]

tsetsaf wrote:
I notice this rule applies mostly to "public" parks. Is it because of this public status that folks feel an overwhelming need to dictate exactly how the site is used? On the other side of this argument we stayed at Valley of Fire SP near Vegas this last spring. Their sites are first come first served. We arrived on a Wed morning and were able to get one of the last sites. Across from us was a family from Germany in a rental rv with no toad. They had driven into the deeper areas of the park for the day leaving behind a stroller to mark their paid for site. Can you guess where this is going? Some locals showed up and decided that since there was no RV in the site then it was free game. Ended up being an ugly scene. IMHO If a site is paid for then it is yours whether you park your rig, tent, or sleep on the ground; sure it is rude to waste the resource if you leave it empty for selfish reasons but that is another discussion altogether.

I thought that was the discussion?

[tsetsaf]

I notice this rule applies mostly to "public" parks. Is it because of this public status that folks feel an overwhelming need to dictate exactly how the site is used? On the other side of this argument we stayed at Valley of Fire SP near Vegas this last spring. Their sites are first come first served. We arrived on a Wed morning and were able to get one of the last sites. Across from us was a family from Germany in a rental rv with no toad. They had driven into the deeper areas of the park for the day leaving behind a stroller to mark their paid for site. Can you guess where this is going? Some locals showed up and decided that since there was no RV in the site then it was free game. Ended up being an ugly scene. IMHO If a site is paid for then it is yours whether you park your rig, tent, or sleep on the ground; sure it is rude to waste the resource if you leave it empty for selfish reasons but that is another discussion altogether.

[MrWizard]

Jagtech wrote:
What is considered as an "occupied site"? As a motorhomer, sometimes I must remove my rig temporarily from the site, for example to make a grocery run. Does a couple of camp chairs and a cooler hold my "paid for, unoccupied site"?

I don't think running to the grocery the dump or any other temporary ( few hrs) absence is the question here.

as a full time Rv'er with a motorcycle and NO car, i have 'temporarily' vacated a site for a few hours, and never had a problem

[2gypsies1]

...gotta remember to stay away from Iowa state parks. What a horrible policy!

[Retired_andLove]

I have hosted in Iowa state parks. There is a 14 day stay limit. On major holidays the parks filled up fast 13 days before the holiday. I don't mean physically filled up but most or all sites were tagged and paid for 13 days before the end of the holiday. Once paid for they do not need to be occupied for any or all of the 14 day period. Nothing needs to be parked on the site as long as a paid for tag is in the window. That's $182 of revenue per site for the period. If the site is paid for and the tag is removed and occupied by someone other than the original camper I can guarantee that person will be escorted out of the campground and lose any fee they paid. I would bet that most sites are spoken for by now for Labor Day weekend by now.
Also half of the sites in most parks are can be reserved 90 days ahead of time. Most are reserved 89 days 23 hours and 59 minutes before a major holiday weekend. Occasionally someone will not show and not cancel. The site is still theirs as long as they paid for it, whether it is occupied or not.
We have never heard a lot of negativity about this policy.

[rhagfo]

MitchF150 wrote:
I think our State Park says you have until the next day by 1pm to occupy or notify them that you still want the site or they will open it up for the next available camper. Oh, and no refund either...

What's been going on with our parks is the reservation system allows you to reserve up to 9 mos ahead of time for up to 10 consecutive days. What people started doing was reserving a site up to 7 days prior to their actual intended arrival date so they get first shot on a Fri-Sun site. After a week or so, they would cancel the prior 7 days and just keep the weekend dates they really wanted, but didn't have to fight to get it reserved, which can happen if you did it 9 mos to that Fri arrival date.

They have to pay a $7 cancel fee, but got refunded for the canceled days.

This year, I think they caught onto this as there is a new policy on cancellations where they will have to pay up to 50% of the canceled days..

Hopefully, this will keep those folks from reserving earlier dates just to cancel them to get the actual dates they want.

To the OP, I feel that if you are indeed going to use the site for the days you reserved for, or are willing to pay for the days you aren't going to be there, at least call the park so they know you won't be checking in until whenever, but you'd still like the site for when you do arrive and understand that you are still paying for the days you are not there..

Mitch

I had to read that three time to understand what you were getting at!
Basically they were reserving the weekend 9 months and 5 days in advance.

[K3WE]

Jagtech wrote:
What is considered as an "occupied site"? As a motorhomer, sometimes I must remove my rig temporarily from the site. Does a couple of camp chairs and a cooler hold my "paid for, unoccupied site"?

Here's where the letter of the law and the intent of the law probably conflict.

The intent is that you don't have folks being turned away from a 'full' campground when campsites are not being used...that is a bad deal and I understand why the policy exists.

Putting some stuff there, just to hold it, is not using it in my opinion and if the campground is full, you have just screwed someone out of using the campground.

Of course, if that meets the rules, then it's more about your concious and what God might say at judgment day.

And- as someone else stated- this is more sticky at a government park...if it's a private park, and you paid your money, it's dfferent than if you are screwing a taxpayer out of camping in a site that is not truly being used.

[Jagtech]

What is considered as an "occupied site"? As a motorhomer, sometimes I must remove my rig temporarily from the site, for example to make a grocery run. Does a couple of camp chairs and a cooler hold my "paid for, unoccupied site"?

[tahiti16]

rockhillmanor wrote:
:s
If someone has paid for a camp site why would anyone else ever care if they used it or not.:? They PAID for it, they can do whatever they want with it.

Same thing with a CG site. I sometimes will pay for a site in advance because I am not sure when I will arrive. That's my insurance. I have PAID for it and I know I will have a spot when I arrive. And again it's not anyone else's business how I use or don't use my paid CG site. :R

This is exactly why several campgrounds here in CA have the occupancy rule. We have so many people vying for campsites that people would pay for a week to get a prime spot for the weekend. In the meantime people that wanted a sitte during the week were turned away or sent to overflow while hookup sites or waterfront sat empty all week.

Once rule was established the sites stay more active and more people get to enjoy the resource, good target for tax supported campground!

[abc40kids]

You can beat this subject up all day and night.... I paid in full for a sight once that ended up I couldn't get there till Saturday as opposed to Friday. When I got there the office told me they were about to give my site to someone else.

Sorry, but if I pay for one, two or three sites there mine unless otherwise stated in their rules or explained to me when I make my reservations. Too one of the above posters..... Yes, if you rent the whole park for the whole weekend it's yours whether you show or not.

Unless stated in the rules it's a pretty simple concept.

[MrWizard]

I've seen people roll in on the tuesday or wednesday before a big holiday (back when we used to camp on big holidays), register, park the camper on the site and disappear until Friday afternoon or sometimes until Saturday morning. totally unfair.

when i was working , i never had the money to buy the site days ahead of time so i could have it for a holiday weekend

but i'm curious,how it is unfair
unfair because they have the money, or unfair because you can't do it, or unfair because it beats the last minute rush and scramble and the uncertainty of getting a site

[pitch]

NYS Parks you have to occupy the site first night, as in warm living body. The remainder of your reservation they do not care if you are there or not.